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I just purchased a pair of 703's and I was wondering how much power should i be providing to them. The local shop i purchased the speakers from said 75 watts each would be plenty, but that number seems low to me.
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75 watts of good power is probably OK. 200 watts of good power is even better
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coming from either a Harmon Kardon, Pioneer Elite, or Denon, would that be sufficient?Comment
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If the Harmon Kardon, Pioneer or Denon say that it's 75 watts per channel, it's not enough.Comment
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Sufficient? Maybe. I really don't know enough about those companies current crop of receivers to comment. I assume these are receivers not dedicated power amps?
What did the store where you bought them use for power? I'll bet it was a dedicated power amplifier, and, likely had more power than either of the three you are looking at. There is a reason for this - the 703 will really take full advantage of good upstream electronics. They like an amplifier that can really deliver current when needed.Comment
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AgreeOriginally posted by dknightd
If you gonna spend all this money on your speakers, get a relly good amp
You can always power them with the reciver for now and they will sound really good, but get a good 200W per chanal amp to hear them come alive.Elmac
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I'd suggest finding a little higher powered receiver if possible, you'll JUST get by with 75 WPC with the 703s and a receiver. I can't recommend a specific model as I don't keep up with them too much. Maybe check out the Rotel?
Starting with a receiver is no problem - makes for a good upgrade path to separates later. Buy a good amp after some time and use the receiver as a processor.DanishComment
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Originally posted by dknightd
They actually had it hooked up to some yamaha receiver, i didn't get the model number though.Comment
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The 703's are great speakers that need great quality electronics...
And the power you need depends on the kind of music (and listening) you do. A solid 75W could do the trick for all except loud rock/heavy stuff. You will need all the 200W that the 703's can take to get that loud. The meters on my amp tell me that I don't use more than 20W very often and that 2W can sound loud...
I prefer to not even comment on Yamaha vs Denon, etc.
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by no means was this thread intended to be a x receiver vs. y receiver. I was just trying to figure out if 75-140 watts (what the 3 receivers i have listed above are rated at on paper), would be sufficient for the 703's. The general concensus here seems to be that it'll work, but that's about it.Comment
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It will work out fine, but as I said before, the 703's will benefit a lot from better electronics. Knowing that, you may want to reconsider your budget for amplication (if possible).Comment
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Be careful of snake oil merchants and audiophile snobs that will have you buying 500W monoblock amps for each channel....Originally posted by CPALIU There is a reason why B&W rate their 703's at 50 to 200W.
One of the guys working at my B&W dealer runs his pair of 704's off of a Denon 3806 and he says it sounds excellent. When I demoed 703's last Saturday they were being driven by a Denon PMA-1500 stereo amp (70W per channel) and sounded superb – that amp is relatively cheap too.
At the end of the month I'm going to buy myself a 4306 which is very conservatively speced at 130W per channel x 7 and I'll have no qualms at all about driving the 703's with it. I will be bi-amping though but even without that it should be more than fine.
Take a look at the recent audioholics review of the 4306 here.
Edit: This may be of interest to some. I talked to a colleague this morning and he told me that he was in Oslo on Saturday listening to some 805's and 804's. Believe it or not but the dealer had them hooked up to a Denon 2807. Apparently the dealer said that the 800 series is nowhere near as difficult to drive as they used to be and the amps in the average receiver are more than powerful enough to drive them to levels loud enough for most people.Comment
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What if I was to move from the 703 to the 704's or even into the 603 and 604? Would it be easy to make those come alive with something around the 130 watt power?Comment
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You might want to give them a try. IMO they can be a better choice with "standard" electronics. In my case, I wouldn't have gone higher than 704's if I didn't get a McIntosh to go with it. Again, it is just my opinion from my experience...Originally posted by CPALIUComment
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Forgive the presumption, but if I read between the lines of your post you may be thinking of matching a pair of 704's with a Rotel RB 1070? Conservatively rated at 130wpc/8ohms?
I use this combination, it works very well up to "moderate" listening levels. A little bit too loud and things start falling apart a bit, but this it probably room dependant... my room's around 40m², so it's kinda "big-ish". In other words I could wish for the extra watts (and current) a RB 1080 can offer me, and I'll probably go the "more power" route sooner or later. Of course some won't agree, someone I know says he's had sucess driving a pair of 704's with a little RA 02 but I remain sceptical.
The 704's rated min. impedence is 4.1 at certain frequencies, so the driving amp has to work fairly hard to drive it without audible strain at times. It's not the most difficult load in the world but a bit of grunt wouldn't hurt. In other words, I think that something like the RB 1070 does work, but like me you might still feel they need a bit more to really shine.Comment
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Well that is exactly that amp I didn't like with 703's and just made me move away from RotelOriginally posted by BTB
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Hi jim...
Well, I own the thing and I have to agree with you... I know that Rotel/B&W is a popular suggested match on these threads, but I just don't think that Rotel electronics best serve the upper B&W ranges, each to his own, I guess, but I just don't think that they can really match the big B&W's in terms of sophistication. I can see the backlash now, as this will not be a popular statement to make, esp. considering the close link between Rotel & B&W in terms of R&D. As I've said in other threads... the Rotels offer near text book electrical performance, but sonically...
Of course this doesn't mean that they are a poor match, just not the best one out there.Comment
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what about going completely into the 600 series? Based on the technical specs on the B&W site, it shows that it needs basically the same amount of power as their 700 series speakers.Originally posted by jim777Comment
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Technical specs are sometimes misleading... they do help, but should be confirmed with a listening test to make double sure.
In any event, I had 603 S3's before changing to the 704's. If my guess was correct and you are planning on using Rotel amplification, the RC/RB 1070 combo was a superb match for the 603's in pretty much every regard. Maybe just on the edge of brightness... but the right choice of cables and CD player can smooth that out considerably.Comment
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What kind music do you listen to? What volume?? Do you want to go MultiChannel in the future??
If multichannel is in your future, forget the 703's right away, they don't have a well-matching center.
And don't forget the new towers in the CM series... they should be great if they are anything like the previous CM series (CM4 & CM6).Comment
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Originally posted by jim777
I do plan on eventually going to a multichannel surround sound in the future, but not at the current moment. I am only interested in the stereo speakers right now. As for music, I listen to a lot of rock and alternative. Not the really heavy rock or punk rock, but sometimes I do listen to some techno/trance type music.Comment
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No, i'm actually planning on using a receiver to power the speakers. Probably something with around 120 watts.Originally posted by BTBComment
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Ok, sorry if this is a kind of standard response... but have you tried any of these combinations with your music, possibly at home? Probably the best way to find out what suits you and your room conditions best.Originally posted by CPALIU
If you use your "known" factors, like your budget, your music taste etc.. and have a shortlist of gear you're interested in, it should make it easier to find the right set up for yourself.Comment
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I brought my own music into the store to listen to and it sounded amazing on the 603, 604, 703, and 704. I liked the mid's and high's a little better on the 700 series speakers, but I can't justify the additional cost + the additional cost for the amplification needed.Originally posted by BTBComment
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Ok,
I don't know what your audio experience is, so I'm not trying to sound condescending, just trying to help... I know for myself, audio purchases can cause some stress & bewilderment, cause you want to get the "right thing" for your money and there are so many good options.
If you have listened to all these speakers and like them all, then maybe getting the cheapest one that suits your purpose for now would be ok? That way you'll have that much more to spend on other areas of your system. Maybe you already have the reciever you've mentioned, but what about upgrading your source, or cables, etc... A sound system is only as good as the sum of it's parts.Comment
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I think this is actually what I'm going to do.Originally posted by BTBComment
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Ok, sounds like a wise move. Good luck.Comment
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power wise, how much should i be looking at supplying to the 603 or 604's? obviously the more the better, but what should I be looking at for the new receiver? I would like to keep the receiver around the $1000-$1500 price range if possibleComment
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I heard the RCD1072 and RA1062 with the 603's and it sounded great! The old CM series even better. Rotel's stereo receiver wasn't as good. The more you put in the same box, the harder it gets for sound quality. Maybe you should reconsider if you really want to go multichannel in the future,,. I began with that idea at the very beginning and after listening a lot of stuff, I decided to go stereo-only all-the-way
Do you listen to a lot of music or you're going to be using your system for a lot of movies?Comment
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it'll be used primarily for music, if i had to put a % on it, it would be like 60% music 40% movies.Comment
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You can almost use any reciever and get good enough sound. I'd look for something around 100 watts. Something that was rated to deliver at least 150 watts into 4 ohms.
It might not be ideal, but it should work well enough. When you have more money and experience you can decide if upgrading speakers or electronics works best for you. You can buy used and double your buying power.
Home trials are the best way to go, but that is not always practical.
Listen to the speakers you like, with the amplifier you will use when you bring them home. You might want to buy both of them from the same place. And that place should be where you listened to them. You might get a discount for buying amp and speakers at the same place. Also ask them about thier upgrade policy. Some stores are very generous about this, some will not even consider it. If you think you might want to upgrade in a year or two this might be a consideration, if you plan to buy and use for years then it may not be as important. All the speakers you are listening to are pretty nice. If you like the 603, and can't decide if you like the 604,704,703 better then buy them. Take them home, smile and be happy! They are fine speakers.
I listen to rock, reggae, jazz, bluegrass, classical. I wanted a speaker that
would give decent bass without a subwoofer. I was only interested in two channel sound. I have a crappy HT setup that keeps the family happy enough. The 604 were fine. I liked the Paradigm studio 100 better. In the end I bought b&w 703 because I could just barely afford them, and I got sucked into the sound of the FST midrange driver. One thing, if you can't bring the speakers home to listen to, spend a lot of time listening to them in the stores. If you find a cooperative store, ask them to let you move speakers around and compare them side by side. Compare cheaper speakers with higher priced electronics against higher priced speakers with less expensive electronics. Once you find a store you like, keep going back. Eventually they might offer you a package deal you would not have otherwise have received because they realize you are serious, and they want to get your business.
In the end it is a balancing act - you have to figure out which balance between speakers/ amps/ money works best for you.
End of beer induced rant. . .Comment
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p.s. You should do internet reasearch as you are doing.
But in the end, buy WHAT WORKS FOR YOU!Comment
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i ended up cancelling the 703's and purchased the 603's instead today. Also picked up a Denon 3806 receiver. I'm still debating if I want this receiver or not since the Pioneer Elite receiver cost the same amount as the Denon. There was also a Yamaha unit that pushed the same amount of power but lacked some of the features that the Denon and Pioneer Elite units had.Comment
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Originally posted by CPALIU
Seeing as the balance of your system use tips in favour of music (only slightly, but still) you could also consider a 2 channel only system, for both music and movies... I use my 2 channel system for both and don't feel too done in on the movie front.
I also started out with a A/V amp with long term plans to go multi channel, but when it really came down to it, music was more important to me and I just figured I could end up with a "better" quality 2 channel system than a "average" surround system for the same money.
Depending on your long term plans, it might be something to consider. Regardless, $1500 will buy a much better stereo amp than a multi channel one.Comment
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I agree 110%.. this is an important choice!!Originally posted by BTB
I had the same choice to make in the beginning and I'm so happy I went stereo-only
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with a two channel system amp, wouldn't i still need a pre amp though? If so wouldn't that cost me well over $1500?Originally posted by BTBComment
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Not with an integrated amp.Originally posted by CPALIU
I really suggest that you try the Rotel RA-1062 with a RCD-1072 CD player... they are a great match to the 600 series.Comment
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would i be able to run a sub and/or center channel if i wanted to in the future?Originally posted by jim777
Also what about using the receiver to power the speakers for now, and then in the future adding a 2 channel amp and using the receiver as a processor. Would that be possible? I hear about all these people using a receiver as a pre-amp (not sure if that's what it's called), but I'm not sure how that works.Comment
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You can fit a sub in pretty much any system, but a stereo integrated like the RA-1062 becomes useless if you decide to add a center channel (or rear channels). Note that it is easier to add a sub if the integrated you buy has pre-amp outputs. The RA-1062 does. Keep the foam plugs that comes with the speakers because if you add the sub, it might sound better if you "plug" your speaker ports.Originally posted by CPALIU
For your 2nd option, the receiver's quality will still be an issue. Of course you could get a processor like the RSP-1068 (that is a pre-amp with more than 2 channels) and a stereo amplifier like the RB-1080. That will cost a lot more than a RA-1062 though. IMO that integrated amp is so much of a bang for the buck$ (if 2 channel sound quality is your thing).
To make a short conclusion, it will cost you a lot more to get the same sound quality in surround than for a stereo-only setup. That is why I made the choice to go stereo-only in the very beginning.Comment
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Originally posted by jim777
I'm not sure if we're allowed to talk about prices here, but ballpark figure, how much would the rsp-1068 + a 2 channel rotel amp cost?Comment
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You're allowed, take a look at the Rotel forum..
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yea those prices are definitely more than i want to spend. Thanks for all the help/info on my possible choices though. I'll just have to make do w/ what I have and enjoy it till i feel i want something more.Comment
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I agree completely regarding the HT vs stereo! When I bought my amp+703s I first had an HT expansion in mind, but looking at the quality of the amps I chose to go stereo only. Haven't regretted that choice! It's at the moment good enough to use the 2ch system also for movies.
It's still possible to use a 2ch in a HT setting for front speakers, especially if you have an input on the stereo amp for that purpose.Comment
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Hi CAPLIU
From your last few posts it seems you might like to go multi channel in the future... so fair enough, you've got to do what suits you best. I guess what some of us are suggesting here is a either/or choice... go 2 channel OR surround. Personal taste is difficult to account for, but I would assume that those of us who do use a 2 channel system in a dual role are pretty happy to get better music performance than film and think that the "small" compromise is worthwhile.
That said, my B&W's image so well that my "phantom" centre is pretty vivid anyway, so it's not like a "hole in the middle" type scenario where I miss a centre channel. And with floorstanders like those 603's there's low end enough to get decent impact from movie sound effects (esp. when properly amplified), clearly not in the realm of a dedicated sub woofer... but like I said the system bias will go one way or the other, with favour shown to one. Personally I'm not a big fan of subs for music playback, I have yet to hear a system set up in such a way that the overall sound is 100% cohesive, but that's just me...
So, good luck. Those 603's are a great start and I'm sure you'll enjoy them for a long while. BTW... assuming these are your first pair of B&W's... Welcome to the club!
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BTB:
Thanks for the welcome mat! This will actually be my first home theatre setup. Actually it will be my first true home speaker set. I think I finally know what my concern was. With a budget of around $3000 would I have been better off getting the 704's w/ about $1000 for the receiver or the 603's with about $1500 for the receiver?Comment
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