B&W Upgrade Path?

[dmccombs]

I am new to this forum, but have done a lot of reading and searching for upgrade info. I suspect my question may still seem repeated to the established forum members. My apologies in advance if it is.

I have the following equipment:
Denon 3806: Prepro (and 2CH amp for channels 6-7 if I go there).
Krell Amps: LRC 250wpc, Rears 200wpc
Sources: Toshiba HD-DVD, Comcast 8300HD
Fronts: 703
Center: HTM7
Rears: 600S3
Sub: SVS 20-39Pci
Currently Testing: HTM1 Center

Between TV, 5.1 HDTV, CDs, and 5.1 Music, I end up doing a 50/50 split between 2CH and 5.1 listening.

I would like to upgrade somethings now, addressing the more major issues (Centers and Rears), and possibly upgrade the Fronts later. When it is all said in done, I would like a well matched system.

Budget (Used Equipment is fine):
About $2k for upgrades now.
And maybe another $3K next year.

As many of you know, matching the 703 with a Center is tough. The HTM7 is ok, but the midrange is pretty different. I am auditioning a HTM1 Center right now, and it is a much better match for the 703 (albiet not perfect). It will be a great match with a 804N or 803N correct? Will it also be a good match with a 803S?

The 600S3 rears are ok, but I know the 5.1 sound will greatly improve if upgrade these too. I am currently considering the 705 (good for now), 805N (great match with HTM1), 805S (Good match with HTM1 and will keep the back lively), or move my current 703s to the Rears when I upgrade the fronts to 800 series. Which sounds like the best option for the rears?

Any advise you can offer would be appreciated.

Darrell

[amdan]

Hi,
I just pulled out the phase plugs on my B&W 703 and put it into my B&W802Ns. The character of the sound of the 802Ns changed to be much more like the 703. I wonder if you would have an easier time matching your centre to your 703s if you upgraded your phase plugs? It might be worth exploring.
BTW the change in sound of the 802Ns was significant when the phase plugs from the 703s were used.

[dmccombs]

Amdan,

This is scary on several fronts. I am not mechanically inclined, so I would want to be darn sure of the what to buy, how to swap the plugs,and the expected results before I start buying parts and doing surgery (even if it is minor).

This is new to me, and sorry if I seem skeptical. If people could reallly make thier 700 series sound like the 800s by just swapping a plug, wouldn't everyone be doing it?

On the other hand, if you are trying to make your 802N like a 703, I would be happy to trade you my 703s for your N802s. :B

[jim777]

That's funny. Someone has already claimed that the 703 phase plugs don't come off..

Are they screwed on or something?

[dmccombs]

Jim, Vise Grips and duct tape will fix about anything...


I'm bummed. I find a B&W speaker forum, post some questions about upgrade paths, and the only reply back at the end of 24 hours, is a suggestion to experimenet with doing some part-swapping on my speakers.

Come on guys, has my question already been covered 100s of times, or is my post too long, confusing, boring, etc.?

Thanks,
Darrell

[jim777]

Isn't the Denon the weak link here?

[dmccombs]

Jim,

I am using the Denon 3806 just as a Prepro. A recent review (by Kal I believe) rated the Denon 4806 very highly as a Prepro. Honestly, I don't know how close the 3806 is to the 4806 as a Prepro.

I actually tried to get some feedback on another forum regarding how close the 3806 was to the 4806, but got no replies.

I do plan to get a good prepro once ther are some reasonable priced HDMI audio ones. The most afforable one I know of now is the Anthem AVM40.


Regards,
Darrell

[htsteve]

Path to 8 Series

dmccombs,

I have N804's mains, HTM1 Center and 705's for rears. This is an excellent sounding system (powered by Rotel electronics and amps). I would suggest the following path based on budget and current equipment.

1 Get the HTM1 for the center. It is an awesome center channel.
2 Next year: move the 703's to the back and get 804S's for the mains.
3 Year after, upgrade your Denon to a new pre-pro.

I believe this will be the best bang for the buck as you move to a higher performing system. Also, if you keep the HTM7 (assuming you get the HTM1) you can use it as a rear center (and run it off the Denon). It could be interesting to try.

Hope this helps.

[dmccombs]

Steve,

I have been reading reviews, etc. and I was thinking along similar lines as your recommendation.

1) I am going to keep the HTM1. I won't be able to buy a HTM3 for years so I think the HTM1 is the best Center I can build upon.

2) The N804 is a perfect match for the HTM1, and yes, the 804S would sound better for 2CH listening although the matching wouldn't be quite as good. I think the 804S would be better for me over all.

3) I could use the 703s for the rear, or nearly even-swap them for 805S or N804. I have some time to figure this piece out.

4) Upgrade the Prepro.


I also was considering another set of options too.

1) Keep the HTM1.

2) Buy another set of 703s. This would give me (4) 703s and the HTM1 for the Center. This would be very well matched.

3) Upgrade the Prepro.


The 1st set of options would be better for 2CH listening. The 2nd set of options would be better balanced for 5.1, but I don't know if it would sound better than the 1st option set.

Which do you think would provide better 5.1 sound?

Thanks,
Darrell

[amdan]

dmccombs,

The phase plugs on the 703 unscrew easily. Just be careful not to damage the cone. It wasn't hard to do.

I don't know how the 703 will sound with the 800 series phase plug which is why I suggested you explore the option rather than heartily recommending you do it. I do know that the character of the 802 changed when I used the 703 phase plugs. I was experimenting because I have seen posters in this forum saying that the aluminium phase plug upgrade for the 802 is very worthwhile. I currently have the plastic ones on my speakers.
BTW I have seen posts (I can't remember where) which claim that the 703 improves when the phase plugs are upgraded.
Thanks for your kind offer to swap speakers but I think I will decline!!

[dmccombs]

Hey, I had to try. I figure if you were modifying your N802s to sound like the 703s, I would kindly offer to make things easier for you by offering you REAL 703s. :rollhead:

Thanks for your kind offer to swap speakers but I think I will decline!!

[jim777]

This is off subject, but where can I order the phase plug upgrades? Or should I just upgrade to 802D's... :scratchhead:

[htsteve]

The 1st set of options would be better for 2CH listening. The 2nd set of options would be better balanced for 5.1, but I don't know if it would sound better than the 1st option set.

Which do you think would provide better 5.1 sound?

Thanks,
Darrell

Darrell,

My vote is for option 1 with a modification. Here it is.

Mains: 804S, excellent for 2 CH. IMO, this would be a better match for the HTM1 than the 703's.

Center: HTM1, enough said.

Rears: 703's in the rear would be cool. However, consider selling or trading these for 805S's or maybe used 804's.

Then the four corners would be current 800 series, with a very close match in the HTM1. Also, you are set up very nicely to get an HTM3 later and you'd have a matched system with excellent 2 CH mains. This set-up with your amplification would be pretty sweet.

Hopefully this answers your final question (which is best for 5.1).

BTW what are you using for a sub? Obviously, this is an important component for 5.1.

[dmccombs]

Steve,

Doh! I knew I was forgeting something in my list. I have a SVS 20-39Pci Sub. I currently have it located behind the seating position near the 600S3 Rears. It sounds better in the back as the LRC combo already has plenty of Bass.

Regards,
Darrell

[amdan]

Hey, I had to try. I figure if you were modifying your N802s to sound like the 703s, I would kindly offer to make things easier for you by offering you REAL 703s. :rollhead:

You are too kind! : I have a pair 703s which I think are great speakers. I wish I had known about the phase plug possibility before getting the 802N. Perhaps that upgrade (?) might have kept me happy. My pair of 703s will be going on eBay when I find the time to do it.

[htsteve]

Steve,

Doh! I knew I was forgeting something in my list. I have a SVS 20-39Pci Sub. I currently have it located behind the seating position near the 600S3 Rears. It sounds better in the back as the LRC combo already has plenty of Bass.

Regards,
Darrell

Darrell,

Nice sub. You've got that part handled.

[dmccombs]

Well, I kept the HTM1, and it sounds great. So now I have:

Denon 3806: Prepro (and 2CH amp for channels 6-7 if I go there).
Krell Amps: LRC 250wpc, Rears 200wpc
Sources: Toshiba HD-DVD, Comcast 8300HD
Fronts: 703
Center: HTM1
Rears: 600S3
Sub: SVS 20-39Pci

So I think the next step is to upgrade the rears. I think a good way to do this is to upgrade the fronts to 804S or N804 speakers and move the 703s to the rear.

Thanks for your help.
Darrell

[kenkkk]

greetings to you all.... i would like to get some help and advices regarding my system.... my system is already 5 years old and i am planning to upgrade whether in the speakers/receivers ar additional pre AMP.... my video room is rather small around 4meters by 3 meters only... currently my Center Speaker is lcr 600 with 602 as my front speaker and 601 as my surround speakers and an MK125 for my sub..... my receiver is rather old YAMAHA RXv530 and i would like to replace it.... and i would like some suggestion to buy a pre amp or equalizer... i dont think i have to upgrade on speakers because my room is rather small... please help me hehe thanks you all

[kenkkk]

correction my receiver is rxv800 and my sub is mk v-1250 thanks

[dmccombs]

A couple people outside this forum suggested that 4 805S speakers with a 80hz crossover point would be better. They thought the bass is best managed purely by the sub.

Obviously 4 of the same speaker would provide great matching for 5.1, but I am afraid 2CH music wouldn't be as nice as having some 804S speakers up fronts.

Any thoughts?